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View Full Version : which sharpening mode to use?


billbachman
03-08-2005, 02:59 AM
Here's one I have not seen in the various forums to date: I have been a very cautious user of the digital hi-res sharpening modes because I do not always like what they do to an image (and yes, I know you can choose wide/medium/narrow etc, but sometimes none of the choices produce results that look all that good to me).

The other day I was sharpening some uncropped RAW images from my Canon 20D and mistakenly applied the "35mm positive film" setting to a couple of them, and guess what? I liked the results a whole lot better than many of the results I have been getting using the digi hi-res settings. Basically the effect is more subtle than the digi hi-res modes - if I can describe it without showing examples, I would say the digitally captured images sharpened using the matching digital sharpening modes look, well, sharpened, and sometimes overly so. The same images sharpened using the "35mm positive" setting - ie, the mode you would use for scanned transparencies - look nice and crisp and are definitely an improvement on the unsharpened version of same - but don't look quite as - and I will use a word here that I have come across before on the forum, imprecise as it may be - crunchy.

OK, one expected response to this is, "If it looks good, do it." But I of course have this nagging feeling that by breaking the rules, so to speak, I am doing something nasty to my image that I can't see. In other words, I am wondering if the PK algorithms for sharpening scans and for sharpening digitallly captured images are so very different that there is a good reason why one should stick with the menu, or conversely if there is no good reason why not to.

This interests me for reasons that may interest others, foremost among them, as has been discussed before on the forums, the fact that Alamy.com submission specifications are very clear about the need for images to be presented "unsharpened". This is all very well, but as many of us have experienced, there is a need to sharpen to some extent, especially if a noise reduction filter has been applied to an image. To my way of seeing (and I am quick to admit that I have not tested this exhaustively, but have done so enough to at least form an opinion), the application of the "35mm positive" sharpening setting produces a result that is not obviously "sharpened" but if compared with its pre-sharpened state, is a great improvement.

Apologies for the length of this, but any feedback would be appreciated, with thanks.

Bill Bachman

Rapt
03-23-2005, 09:25 AM
I'm no expert (just started using PK sharpener) but are you applying the capture sharpening to a raw image processed with no additional sharpening or are you applying it to one which has already had either some in-camera sharpening OR some sharpening in Camera RAW?

The reason I ask is that I find that the capture sharpening mode generally isn't enough "straight out of the box" when applying it to RAW images that I have purposely removed any other sharpening from in initial processing. I prefer leaving ALL my sharpening to PK where I at least have better control (and understanding) of what is happening and how its applied. This seems to be universal for me shooting with a 10D whether dealing with a singe frame 6MP or a 78MP stitched image.

(That said I haven't tried applying any of the modes intended for other capture processes. So I can't comment on what the 35 mm sharpening might be doing. Or how it affects images.)

Wendell Rider
04-01-2005, 09:16 PM
Hi
I have done the same thing on scans of 35mm negatives and what I think is going on is that there is smoothing (noise reduction) going on with the sharpening- depending on the "speed" of the film. I'm pretty sure there is nothing wrong with this as there is a similar choice for sharpen and smooth in the digital list. This seems to be just another version, or choice, to use. If you watch it work though, it does do a lot of different things from the digital choices. I guess you can only decide if it is doing too much for your purposes.

Guitar Adoptions
04-07-2005, 10:19 AM
I just tried it myself, and I agree that 35mm works much better for me as the Raw sharpening!
I can then do my adjustments, resize for the web, apply Output sharpening, and I'm done!
Thanks so much!

I would love to hear from more people on tips and tricks!

Rapt
04-07-2005, 11:22 AM
Its funny because when I tried the 35 mm method I found the images tended to lose the nice smoothness digital is known for. They instead developed what looks to me like "grain" from over sharpening of digital artifacts rather than real image data. Not bad, just not a look I prefer.

I tweak with the capture sharpener expert mode, right away. Do my corrections and then output sharpen immediately before printing. Of course web images and prints require very different sharpening and I mainly do prints.

Guitar Adoptions
04-07-2005, 02:02 PM
I'm trying to figure out the quickest and most effective way to sharpen my Raw images, then resize to 450 pixels wide, and then sharpen for web.
Any suggestions are greatly appreciated.
PS I am shooting with a D100

faeyer
04-07-2005, 02:22 PM
Its funny because when I tried the 35 mm method I found the images tended to lose the nice smoothness digital is known for. They instead developed what looks to me like "grain" from over sharpening of digital artifacts rather than real image data. Not bad, just not a look I prefer.

I have found the very same effect if I try to capture sharpen as 35mm film. I did it by mistake too! I'm shooting Canon Mk IIs, results may be different with other models or brands.

As a side note, it would nice if PKS could offer preferences settings that would allow us to set the default for Capture, Creative and Output sharpening methods. I'm not sure if this is technically possible, though.

Faeyer